Democracy Now! has听looked back at the life and legacy of John McCain, the six-term senator and two-time presidential candidate, who died on August 25 at the age of 81. McCain began his decades-long political career after he was a naval pilot in the Vietnam War, where he spent more than five years as a prisoner of war after his plane was shot down in Hanoi in 1967.听
In 1973, upon McCain鈥檚 release from being a prisoner of war and his return to the United States, he wrote an article expressing support for President Nixon and the U.S. bombing of Cambodia. After McCain鈥檚 election to the U.S. Senate in 1987, he consistently promoted war and U.S. military intervention abroad, including in the first Gulf War, Afghanistan and Iraq, as well as Iran.听McCain joked about bombing Iran at a 2007 campaign event during his presidential bid against Barack Obama.
In 2008,听McCain ran for president vowing to deploy a surge of US听troops to Iraq. He failed to win the election, and faced criticism for his choice of Alaska Governor Sarah Palin as his running mate, who some say paved the way for the election of Donald Trump.
In the video below, Democracy Now!听speaks to three guests:听Mehdi Hasan, columnist for听The Intercept, host of their听Deconstructed听podcast; Medea Benjamin, co-founder of CodePink; and Norman Solomon, national coordinator of RootsAction. the full transcript is below.
础惭驰听骋翱翱顿惭础狈:听In 2008, John McCain ran for president vowing to deploy a surge of U.S. troops to Iraq. He failed to win the election, and faced criticism for his choice of Alaska Governor Sarah Palin as his running mate, who some say paved the way for the election of Donald Trump.
Senator McCain was also known for reaching across the aisle and working with Democrats on key issues. In 1995, he worked with John Kerry, a fellow Vietnam War veteran, but Kerry had opposed the war, to provide political cover for President Clinton to normalize relations with Vietnam. Last year McCain made headlines when he came back to the Senate and voted 鈥渢humbs down鈥 against the Republican-led repeal of the Affordable Care Act.
After McCain鈥檚 death,听The Washington Post听reports President Trump rejected issuing a White House statement praising McCain; instead, he tweeted, 鈥淢y deepest sympathies and respect go out to the family of Senator John McCain. Our hearts and prayers are with you!鈥 unquote. Former Presidents Barack Obama and George W. Bush will deliver eulogies at McCain鈥檚 funeral at the National Cathedral on Saturday. McCain鈥檚 family has asked Trump not attend the service.
For more, we鈥檙e joined by three guests. In Washington, D.C., Mehdi Hasan is with us, columnist for听The Intercept, host of their听Deconstructed听podcast. He鈥檚 also host of听UpFront听at Al Jazeera English. He鈥檚 been tweeting in response to McCain鈥檚 death. He wrote a听听there last year headlined 鈥淒espite What the Press Says, 'Maverick' McCain Has a Long and Distinguished Record of Horribleness.鈥 Also in Washington is Medea Benjamin, co-founder of CodePink. And here in New York we鈥檙e joined by Norman Solomon, national coordinator of RootsAction. He鈥檚 also executive director of the Institute for Public Accuracy, author of听War Made Easy: How Presidents and Pundits Keep Spinning Us to Death, among other books.
We welcome you all to听Democracy Now!听Norman, let鈥檚 begin with you. Your response to, well, the death of Senator McCain, his life and his legacy?
狈翱搁惭础狈听厂翱尝翱惭翱狈:听It鈥檚 really natural to have a lot of empathy for someone who suffered through brain cancer, admiration for people who withstood great hardships with pride and determination. However, what we鈥檝e seen is really what could be called the phenomenon of obit omit鈥攐bituaries that are flagrantly in conflict with the real historical record. And when you stop and think about it, you know, journalism is supposed to be the first draft of history. And when history is falsified in the way that we鈥檙e getting in the last few couple of days now, several days, really, in the lead-up to Senator McCain鈥檚 death, it鈥檚 really a kind of a fraudulence on the part of the U.S. mass media. If John McCain was a maverick, it鈥檚 only a high jump over very low standards. And while there were certainly some, from a progressive standpoint, admirable characteristics that he had, he also was a huge enthusiast for war, which included after his return from being a prisoner in Vietnam.
础惭驰听骋翱翱顿惭础狈:听Mehdi Hasan, your reflection on the career of John McCain, who died this weekend at his home in Arizona of brain cancer?
惭贰贬顿滨听贬础厂础狈:听I think Norman is right to point to the obit-omit phenomenon. I think that鈥檚 one of the things I鈥檝e taken away from the past couple of days, just watching some of the media coverage, which is less journalism and more hagiography. We know what McCain was good at and what he was praised for, but we鈥檙e not hearing about some of the darker sides of his political record. And there鈥檚 nothing wrong with bringing some light to the darker parts of a politician鈥檚, a public figure鈥檚 record. This is not some sort of dancing on his grave. This is talking about what he did.
And, you know, look at his career. He was a man who was involved in a massive financial scandal in the late 1980s. He was part of the Keating Five, the savings-and-loan scandal. He agitated, as you mentioned, Amy, in your introduction, for the illegal and catastrophic invasion and occupation of Iraq鈥攏ever apologized, never showed any regret for that. In 2008, he ran a nasty, desperate and bigoted campaign for the presidency of the United States, alongside Sarah Palin, which, as you pointed out, again, did pave the way for the election of Donald Trump and for Trumpism in 2016. These are things he should be held to account for. You also mentioned his famous and welcome vote鈥攍ast-minute vote, I should add鈥攁gainst Obamacare last year鈥攕orry, in defense of Obamacare, saving Obamacare, in a way, last year. But we don鈥檛 talk about his vote for the big Trump tax cuts, which also involved the killing of the Obamacare individual mandate. He was not a maverick, as Norman says. He was a maverick in name only.
础惭驰听骋翱翱顿惭础狈:听Medea Benjamin, you had direct experience with Senator McCain, your organization. You鈥檙e co-founder of CodePink.
惭贰顿贰础听叠贰狈闯础惭滨狈:听Yes. We had constantly been lobbying John McCain to not support all these wars. Amy, I think it鈥檚 so horrible to be calling somebody a war hero because he participated in the bombing of Vietnam. I just spent the last weekend with Veterans for Peace, people who are atoning for their sins in Vietnam by trying to stop new wars. John McCain hasn鈥檛 done that. With his life, what he did was support wars from not only Iraq, but also Libya. He called John Kerry delusional for trying to make a nuclear deal with Iran, and threw his lot in with the听MEK, the extremist group in Iran. He also was a good friend of Mohammad bin Salman and the Saudis. There was a gala for the Saudis in May when the crown prince was visiting, and they had a special award for John McCain. He supported the Saudi bombing in Yemen that has been so catastrophic. And I think we have to think that those who have participated in war are really heroes if they spend the rest of their lives trying to stop war, not like John McCain, who spent the rest of his life supporting war.
础惭驰听骋翱翱顿惭础狈:听Norman Solomon?
狈翱搁惭础狈听厂翱尝翱惭翱狈:听And we really have to fault the mass media of the United States, not just for the last few days, but the last decades, pretending that somehow, by implication, almost that John McCain was doing the people of North Vietnam a favor as he flew over them and dropped bombs. You would think, in the hagiography that we鈥檝e been getting about his role in a squadron flying over North Vietnam, that he was dropping, you know, flowers or marshmallows or something. He was shot down during his 23rd mission dropping bombs on massive numbers of human beings, in a totally illegal and immoral war.
础惭驰听骋翱翱顿惭础狈:听I wanted to turn to President Trump as candidate in 2016, when he attacked John McCain.
顿翱狈础尝顿听罢搁鲍惭笔:听Somebody should run against John McCain, who has been, you know, in my opinion, not so hot. And I supported him. I supported him for president. I raised a million dollars for him. It鈥檚 a lot of money. I supported him. He lost. He let us down. But, you know, he lost. So I never liked him as much after that, because I don鈥檛 like losers. But鈥攂ut, Frank鈥擣rank, let me get to it.
贵搁础狈碍听尝鲍狈罢窜:听He鈥檚 a war hero.
顿翱狈础尝顿听罢搁鲍惭笔:听He hit me鈥
贵搁础狈碍听尝鲍狈罢窜:听He鈥檚 a war hero.
顿翱狈础尝顿听罢搁鲍惭笔:听He鈥檚 not a war hero.
贵搁础狈碍听尝鲍狈罢窜:听He鈥檚 a war hero.
顿翱狈础尝顿听罢搁鲍惭笔:听He is a war hero鈥
贵搁础狈碍听尝鲍狈罢窜:听Five-and-a-half years in a听POW听camp.
顿翱狈础尝顿听罢搁鲍惭笔:听He鈥檚 a war hero because he was captured. I like people that weren鈥檛 captured, OK? I hate to tell you.
础惭驰听骋翱翱顿惭础狈:听Mehdi Hasan, 鈥淚 like people who weren鈥檛 captured,鈥 says now-President Trump.
惭贰贬顿滨听贬础厂础狈:听I mean, whatever your views of John McCain, it was a disgraceful remark from a draft-dodging then-presidential candidate, Donald Trump. But let鈥檚 be clear: The Trump-McCain rivalry, animosity, which the media have been focusing on a lot, especially this morning with the flags back at full staff at the White House and, you know, this听Washington Post听report about Trump refusing to call him a hero and changing the statement and not saying anything positive about McCain鈥擨 mean, look, that is Donald Trump being the petty man-child that we know he is.
And, in fact, John McCain benefited from the fact that Donald Trump hated him, because it made him even more popular with the media, who could play this鈥攁nd the media loves, you know, rows and personalities and disagreements. So the idea of McCain being this anti-Trump figure was great for them. And McCain obliged by giving them great rhetoric attacking Trump.
But when you look at the record, if you look at actual the听, McCain voted with Trump 80 percent of the time since 2016. He wasn鈥檛 some great rebel in actions. The thing about John McCain was he was great at rhetoric. The actions didn鈥檛 always match the rhetoric. And that is what the media gave him cover for.
Norman is right: The media have a lot to answer for when it comes to McCain. McCain cultivated the media. A lot of reporters on Twitter over the last couple of days have been saying he was their friend, which is a weird phrase to use for a politician. And McCain himself called the media 鈥渕y base.鈥 That鈥檚 how he got his reputation as a maverick. That鈥檚 how he鈥檚 getting all this hagiographical coverage right now on the cable news channels, from right and left alike.
础惭驰听骋翱翱顿惭础狈:听I鈥檇 like to go back to 2015, when then-Senate Armed Services Committee Chair Senator John McCain lashed out at CodePink protesters, who were calling for former national security adviser and secretary of state, Henry Kissinger, to be arrested for war crimes. Our guest, Medea Benjamin, was one of the protesters whose voice is clearly audible.
颁翱顿贰笔滨狈碍听笔搁翱罢贰厂罢贰搁厂:听Arrest Henry Kissinger for war crimes!
惭贰顿贰础听叠贰狈闯础惭滨狈:听In the name of the people of Chile!
颁翱顿贰笔滨狈碍听笔搁翱罢贰厂罢贰搁厂:听Arrest Henry Kissinger for war crimes!
惭贰顿贰础听叠贰狈闯础惭滨狈:听In the name of the people of Vietnam!
颁翱顿贰笔滨狈碍听笔搁翱罢贰厂罢贰搁厂:听Arrest Henry Kissinger for war crimes!
UNIDENTIFIED:听We don鈥檛 want to hear from you anymore!
惭贰顿贰础听叠贰狈闯础惭滨狈:听In the name of the people of Chile! In the name of the people of Vietnam! In the name of the people of East Timor!
厂贰狈.听闯翱贬狈听惭肠颁础滨狈:听You know鈥
惭贰顿贰础听叠贰狈闯础惭滨狈:听In the name of the people of Cambodia! In the name of the people of Laos!
厂贰狈.听闯翱贬狈听惭肠颁础滨狈:听I鈥檇 like to say to my colleagues and to our distinguished witnesses this morning that I have鈥擨鈥檝e been a member of this committee for many years, and I have never seen anything as disgraceful and outrageous and despicable as the last demonstration that just took place about鈥攜ou know, you鈥檙e going to have to shut up, or I鈥檓 going to have you arrested. If we can鈥檛 get the Capitol Hill police in here immediately鈥攇et out of here, you low-life scum.
础惭驰听骋翱翱顿惭础狈:听That was Senator McCain in 2015. Medea, I heard your voice a little time before that, talking about holding Kissinger accountable for the people of Laos and Cambodia.
惭贰顿贰础听叠贰狈闯础惭滨狈:听Well, the question is: Why would John McCain bring in Henry Kissinger as an expert to tell us how we should move forward with U.S. foreign policy? From the time that in the late '90s John McCain threw his lot in with the Project for the New American Century and the neocons, John McCain has been looking towards people who see militarism and U.S. intervention and the U.S. right to overthrow other governments as his ticket鈥擨 would say, for his personal ambitions. And I think, really, calling us 鈥渓ow-life scum,鈥 instead of looking at the record of Henry Kissinger, or let's just look at the record of John McCain himself, and say these are not the people that we should be lionizing.
惭贰贬顿滨听贬础厂础狈:听What鈥檚 interesting about that exchange, Amy, is not just the whole defense of Kissinger and a militarized foreign policy, but the language used. Here are antiwar protesters in the Senate using their democratic right to protest, and he calls them 鈥渓ow-life scum.鈥 And yet, we鈥檙e being told for the last 48 hours that John McCain was the embodiment of civility in U.S. politics, he was a bastion of decency. Even Bernie Sanders used that phrase. And yet, even McCain himself probably wouldn鈥檛 recognize that description. He was a well-known cranky and rude and abusive figure. He called antiwar protesters 鈥渓ow-life scum.鈥 He mocked Chelsea Clinton as ugly. He made jokes about rape and spousal abuse. He famously called his Vietnamese captors 鈥済ooks鈥 and said, 鈥淚 won鈥檛 apologize for that.鈥 He used the C-word against his wife in public. He has a long history of not behaving in a civil manner. He ran a presidential campaign in 2008, Amy, where at the rallies of McCain and Palin people shouted out 鈥渢errorist,鈥 鈥渢raitor,鈥 鈥渙ff with his head,鈥 鈥渒ill him,鈥 in reference to Barack Obama. Today we condemn Donald Trump for holding rallies where they say 鈥渓ock her up.鈥 Where is the condemnation of those rallies in 2008 that John McCain presided over?
础惭驰听骋翱翱顿惭础狈:听I want to turn to John McCain in 2008, as you鈥檙e describing, but this was in New Hampshire at a town hall meeting when he defended his presidential opponent, Barack Obama, his rival, in the face of constituents spouting racist conspiracy theories. This is a clip.
惭肠颁础滨狈听厂鲍笔笔翱搁罢贰搁:听I got to ask you a question. I do not believe in鈥擨 can鈥檛 trust Obama. I have read about him, and he鈥檚 not鈥攈e鈥檚 not鈥攈e鈥檚 an Arab. He is not鈥
厂贰狈.听闯翱贬狈听惭肠颁础滨狈:听No, ma鈥檃m. No, ma鈥檃m.
惭肠颁础滨狈听厂鲍笔笔翱搁罢贰搁:听狈辞?
厂贰狈.听闯翱贬狈听惭肠颁础滨狈:听No, ma鈥檃m. No, ma鈥檃m. He鈥檚 a decent family man, citizen, that I just happen to have disagreements with on fundamental issues. And that鈥檚 what this campaign is all about. He is not.
础惭驰听骋翱翱顿惭础狈:听There are so many levels to address this on, Mehdi Hasan. If you could start?
惭贰贬顿滨听贬础厂础狈:听Yeah, I mean, look, I鈥檝e been thinking about this clip a lot for the last couple days. It鈥檚 gone viral. It鈥檚 had millions of views on Twitter. And it鈥檚 being held out by a lot of people as, you know, McCain鈥檚 moment of nobility in 2008, where he defended Barack Obama, compared to Donald Trump, of course, who spread birther conspiracies about Obama being a secret Muslim.
And, you know, some of us have criticized that. I鈥檝e always found that clip uncomfortable, to say the least, because even if you give John McCain the benefit of the doubt and say it was a spur-of-the-moment, off-the-cuff response to the woman, he didn鈥檛 address her point that Obama was an Arab. There is this weird disjunction, where she says, 鈥淗e鈥檚 an Arab,鈥 and he says, 鈥淣o, he鈥檚 a decent family man,鈥 which seems to say that, 鈥淲ell, hold on, are Arabs not decent family men?鈥 Now, McCain defenders would say, 鈥淣o, he wasn鈥檛 referring to the Arab point; he was preempting her line about鈥攕he was going to say he was a terrorist or a noncitizen.鈥
But the point is, there was that prejudice already back then in 2008, well before Donald Trump, in the Republican base, this animosity towards Muslims, towards Arabs, towards foreigners. And John McCain never took the opportunity鈥攃ertainly not in that exchange鈥攖o question the underlying bigoted premise, in the way that Colin Powell did, for example, at the same time. He went on TV at the same time, Powell, and he said, 鈥淟ook, is Barack Obama an Arab or a Muslim? No, he鈥檚 not. But so what if he is?鈥 That 鈥淪o what if he is?鈥 was never said by John McCain. In fact, John McCain ran a campaign in 2008, which, again, I鈥檒l say it again, we keep forgetting and airbrushing, in which Obama was presented to the American people as a terrorist, as a friend of terrorists. That鈥檚 outrageous.
础惭驰听骋翱翱顿惭础狈:听Norman Solomon?
狈翱搁惭础狈听厂翱尝翱惭翱狈:听Well, there鈥檚 a spectrum of problems here. I mean, if you go to the broader one that Mehdi was just talking about, we鈥檝e had a whole history, from George W. Bush through Barack Obama to Hillary Clinton, of people saying, 鈥淥h, we support Muslims; Muslims are part of the American family,鈥 while those same leaders are slaughtering Muslims in Afghanistan, in Libya, in Iraq, and hoping to do it, in many cases, elsewhere in the Middle East. So, this whole notion that you say a few platitudes and that justifies your militaristic and really mass-murderous, truly, foreign policy is a problem.
When you get to that specific clip, which has gotten huge play in the last 48 hours, the reality is that even more disturbing than the off-the-cuff response from Senator McCain is the approach from the mass media of the United States, which seems clueless鈥攋ust it鈥檚 an irony-free zone鈥攁bsolutely not addressing what the real message or a key part of that message was, which is, if you鈥檙e an Arab, then you鈥檙e not a decent family man, but if you鈥檙e a decent family man, then, oh, no, you鈥檙e not really an Arab. What an ugly, corrosive and truly racist message that is.
础惭驰听骋翱翱顿惭础狈:听And the significance of the major funeral memorial at the National Cathedral this weekend that President Bush will eulogize McCain, President Obama will eulogize McCain, and people are now saying that McCain made clear he didn鈥檛 even want Trump there?
狈翱搁惭础狈听厂翱尝翱惭翱狈:听Yes, well, Trump is another brand of militaristic foreign policy that I think has to be opposed just as much as the particular brand that his buddy Lindsey Graham and McCain himself embodied. There鈥檚 been a lot of coverage in听The Washington Post听and elsewhere in the last day bemoaning that, with McCain gone, the traditional militarism from the Pentagon and the听CIA听and so forth won鈥檛 be as strong against Trump. And it鈥檚 simply, in a way, a falling-out between McDonald鈥檚 and Burger King. These two factions of the Republican Party are both so vicious and so militaristic, embodying what Dr. King called the 鈥渕adness of militarism.鈥
础惭驰听骋翱翱顿惭础狈:听Mehdi Hasan?
惭贰贬顿滨听贬础厂础狈:听And what鈥檚 so really ironic about the whole kind of McCain-Trump split on policy, when it comes to foreign policy, the Trump administration is the most hawkish administration we鈥檝e ever seen when it comes to Iran. We鈥檙e seeing them now ramping up efforts to target Iran in terms of breaking out of the Iran deal, in terms of appointing this new office at the State Department to keep an eye on Iran. You鈥檝e got Iran hawks at every level of the Trump administration. If Donald Trump in future years, God forbid, does go to war with Iran, well, if John McCain had been alive, he鈥檇 be egging Donald Trump on. We know that. We saw the clip at the beginning of the show where he was singing jokingly about bombing Iran. So, yeah, I think Norman is spot-on to say, you know, the actual differences there when it comes to the mass-murderous foreign policy between a Trump and a McCain, not that much.
础惭驰听骋翱翱顿惭础狈:听And the fact right now the White House is flying its flag at full staff, whereas in places like the Washington Monument they have them lowered. Medea,听The New York Times鈥 FiveThirtyEight reports McCain voting with Trump 83 percent of the time.
惭贰顿贰础听叠贰狈闯础惭滨狈:听Well, that鈥檚 right. I think we should really look at this in the larger context of the glorification of militarism, the way McCain was in favor of the expansion of听NATO, threatening towards both China and Russia. This is all in the benefit of the weapons industry. We can see Lockheed Martin doing a eulogy, which they did for John McCain. So, let鈥檚 remember, we want to thank those who don鈥檛 fight in wars, the conscientious objectors, the peacemakers, and recognize John McCain of a symbol of the glorification of military that we have to fight against.
听